The God Who Wasn't There (2005)

Ronald G. Sipus: Self - Superintendent, Village Christian Schools

Quotes 

• [talking about the Village Christian School's policies] 

  Narrator : In the Handbook, there's a statement of faith. Uh, and, uh, it has seven points, and some of them are: "We believe the Bible to be the inspired, the only infallible, authoritative Word of God." "We believe that there is one God, eternally existent in three persons: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit." "We believe in the resurrection of both the saved and the lost; they that are saved unto the resurrection of life and they that are lost unto the resurrection of damnation." Tell me, what hard scientific evidence do you have that the world works this way?

  Ronald G. Sipus : [fidgeting]  Well, the mistake that a lot of Christians make is trying to convince people that what they believe spiritually... um... can be proven. Now, first of all, there is a lot of historical evidence that Jesus was who he said he was. There's a lot of historical evidence that proves his resurrection. So, if you want, if you're looking for historical and scientific data that proves whether Jesus was and existed and resurrected, there's evidence that, that, that will produce that. But the fact of the matter is, it's, it is a faith issue.

• Ronald G. Sipus : Have I ever seen God? No. Have you? No, no. How do I know He's there? How do I know that what Scripture says is true? Can I prove that with empirical data that says it's true? No. It's a faith issue.

  Narrator : Well, have you thought, then, that maybe teaching eighteen hundred students that the world *does* operate this way and you don't have any evidence that it does - Have you considered that it might be the height of irresponsibility to do that?

  Ronald G. Sipus : No, absolutely not. I think the heighth of irresponsibility is to ignore the reality of God, to, to ignore the reality of the person of Jesus Christ. I mean...

  Narrator : But you're using the word "reality." You just said that there's no empirical evidence.

  Ronald G. Sipus : Oh, there is empirical evidence.

  Narrator : ...reality...

  Ronald G. Sipus : Oh, there is.

  Narrator : Oh, now there is?

  Ronald G. Sipus : There is absolutely empirical evidence. No, it's not a matter of *now* there is. I said, a moment ago, there's absolute empirical evidence that Jesus existed. That he was real.

  Narrator : No, I mean about the world working. You said that it's a matter of faith that the world operates, you know, the Holy Spirit that needs to fill you, and that there's going to be a resur- You said, I mean, all of that stuff, you will admit, is not scientifically accurate.

  Ronald G. Sipus : [nodding]  Absolutely. Absolutely, that is true.

  Narrator : So since it's *faith*, and since it's *your faith*, I mean, what do you think about teaching a kindergarten child that the world works that way?

  Ronald G. Sipus : I don't have any problem with that at all, because we, it is a matter of saying to young people, "This is what we believe to be true, and every person has to ultimately be accountable for what they believe."

  Narrator : Okay, well, have you thought about maybe adding to this Statement of Faith, here, maybe a Number 8, "Um, by the way, we might be wrong, and you should investigate for yourself"?

  Ronald G. Sipus : No. We, well, well, I, let me tell ya, I wouldn't put that on the Statement of Faith, but we say to all of our kids coming through, "This is something you must believe yourself." Now, there are kids who come to our school who do not believe Christianity. So we're saying, "Okay, that's okay. Make that statement. But now write a position paper that proves that your position is correct."

  Narrator : So the burden of proof is on the student who would say that the world operates according to scientific principles?

  Ronald G. Sipus : [nodding]  Mm-hm, mm-hm.

  Narrator : And the rest of the students are basically taught that they must believe that the world operates according to these supernatural principles?

  Ronald G. Sipus : We're not saying that they *must* believe anything. We're saying that here's what the Bible says. Our basis is the Bible. And a person has to decide whether they believe the Bible to be true or whether they believe the Bible to be false.

  Narrator : But this is - The Bible is first century and before symbolic literature. I mean, do you really think it's a good thing to teach children that it's literal?

  Ronald G. Sipus : Well.

  [Hesitates] 

  Ronald G. Sipus : Literal interpretation, uh, for example, uh, God created the world in seven days. Does that mean seven 24-hour days? Or does that mean that a day is a million years?

  [Shaking his head] 

  Ronald G. Sipus : What does that mean? And there, there are all kinds of arguments that take place within the Christian community about that.

  Narrator : Well, that's true, but I was taught very specific things here. For example, it says here in the Handbook, "The principal emphasis of the school is to encourage and to lead students to accept Jesus Christ -"

  Ronald G. Sipus : Can, can we stop, can we stop for a minute?

  Narrator : "... as their Savior and to commit themselves to Christ as Lord of their lives." I mean...

  Ronald G. Sipus : We need to stop for a minute.

• Ronald G. Sipus : We need to stop for a minute.

  Narrator : Why?

  Ronald G. Sipus : I wanna ask you a question off the, off the camera.

  Narrator : Why off? I mean, I'll answer it. I'm here. You can ask me anything. What I wanted to talk to you about was, I mean, ideas - I was taught at this school that you would be eternally damned if you denied the Holy Spirit.

  Ronald G. Sipus : Brian, you know what you've done? You've been dishonest in setting up this interview.

  Narrator : What, what is dishonest? I wrote you an email and I...

  Ronald G. Sipus : Yeah, yeah, yeah, and there's... We've been spending the last five to seven minutes trying to make you feel good about what you feel you were punished about here. Not what you told me we were gonna talk about.

  Narrator : I told you we were gonna talk about the education of children.

  [Sipus rises, adjusts his tie, and walks off-screen] 

  Narrator : And I'm here to talk about the educa- Oh, now you're ending the interview?

  Narrator : Mm-hm.

  Narrator : Why? Why are you ending the interview? All right.

• [During the final credits] 

  Ronald G. Sipus : It really is a faith issue. People say, "Well, uh, what's the difference between evolution as a fact and creationism as a fact?" The truth of the matter is, neither one are facts. Because if, if... You can't replicate either one. You, you can see evidence of evolution between species, but you can't see it from species to species, from, from any of that. But, but it is, it is, uh, it is not scientifically without flaw, itself. Uh, creationism has all kinds of evidences, scientific evidence, that more, the more, the more we find about science, the more we see that it is, it is, it is accurate, but my personal belief in Jesus Christ is a faith issue.